Curse

Orochim4ru · Aug 02, 2005, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Someone asked for a link, and i provide a link

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=34555

The math is fuzzy, but the general gist of it is about right.

Also: No UAS, EVER. ANet has specifically said so and told us to stop being babies about it, even if the idea is sound.

Aracos79 · Aug 02, 2005, 05:57 AM // 05:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orochim4ru

Someone asked for a link, and i provide a link

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=34555

The math is fuzzy, but the general gist of it is about right.

Also: No UAS, EVER. ANet has specifically said so and told us to stop being babies about it, even if the idea is sound.

This is exactly why I can't believe ANet simply doesn't care, as some posters have said. They need to have expansion sales to sustain the game.

You know, I used to be against UAS (as a mostly PvE player) and then I realized... it doesn't matter. They only people that would leave PvE permanently if they implemented UAS would be the people who don't care about PvE anyway. And those people tend to be a pain in the neck to party with. But... with ANet saying flatly, no way, it doesn't really matter. :P

varyag · Aug 02, 2005, 06:09 AM // 06:09

I don't care about specific methods and your arguments over proposed solutions. Its way beyond that.

I just want to "Develop a richly personalized character that can explore multiple professions and hundreds of unique skills".
I just want to "Be rewarded based on your gaming skill, not hours played"

I shouldn't be discussing ways to implement it. I payed for it!
God damnit. =/

Saerden · Aug 02, 2005, 06:26 AM // 06:26

For the 100th time: UAU (unlock everything) is already in the game. Its called:

Get rushed by Guild while your afk. Get lots of runes while your afk. Farming is at least 1000% more efficient then regular gameplay (concerning runes and weapon upgrades). You dont need hard work, effort or some such nonsense. Open your eyes, you just need rushers / rush the newbs.

And you can compete with premades, because everything resembling a skilled player is so sick, he already left. [ Or your so skilled, you can win with a necro/warrior using bows.]

ANET does a great job, they finally got rid of the 1% of hardcore, dedicated pvp players who where fanboing this game prerelease like no PR department ever could. Instead they got themself hardcore farmers who take server space 24/7 and are in fierce competition with the botteres, who, for some reason, manage to bot in a grindfree game. gg.

Guild-Hall Messenger · Aug 02, 2005, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saerden

ANET does a great job, they finally got rid of the 1% of hardcore, dedicated pvp players who where fanboing this game prerelease like no PR department ever could.

Yeah I will personally agree on that, I gave this game astounding reviews/PR prerelease on other gaming forums. A few weeks after release I felt pretty stupid suckering people into the game I thought it was.

"Hey this game is great! anyone can play PVP and they added Unlocking so there is no grind"

lol

Legendary Battousai · Aug 02, 2005, 06:35 AM // 06:35

for your sakes, i hope that was sarcasm, saedan....

Takkun · Aug 02, 2005, 07:04 AM // 07:04

I think we can all agree that the biggest mistake ArenaNet made on this game was daring to lure in both PvE and PvP lovers into the same game... nice try guys.

PvPers and PvEers view games and play games very differently. Which is why starcraft, counter-strike, and other games have been around for ages. Each game draws in only one type of player, not all types. If you like to play through missions and get head deep into game plots, play.... uh.... well im not a PvEer so I don't know many games that do this... oh wait I know one: Half-Life 2, great game.
If you like to completely dominate other actual players and spill torrents of blood, play doom, cs, starcraft, etc.

The only game I know of that actually succeeded in drawing in both crowds would be diablo II, but the amount of content that was actually implemented into that game was meager... I would have loved an act VI.

I went a lil bit off topic, but my point still stands.

Xellos · Aug 02, 2005, 07:22 AM // 07:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tigris Of Gaul

I really have no knock on their games, but their support is horrendous. I can understand that you need to support your cash cow to the fullest, but why should I have to pay a monthly fee to get you to notice me?

I liked their free Bnet. WoW I don't really care about and consider it milking the cash cow. Warcraft 3 you could at least see they tried to make things new, whereas WoW frigging had icons from Wc3. That's pathetic.

Aracos79 · Aug 02, 2005, 07:29 AM // 07:29

Thank you Takkun... that was my original point in my first post this afternoon. The difference in philosophy is at the heart of this whole problem/discussion.

RTSFirebat · Aug 02, 2005, 07:37 AM // 07:37

I find it interesting that most (From what I seen) PvE people are happy to do some PvP sometimes, we don't complain, or bitch, we just get on with it. Me personally I do enjoy PvP or the Tombs every now and again.

Yet to make it to the HoH however

lol

And then again a lot of PvP are unwilling to try PvE in return, calling it "grind" and annoying. Ok the game's story is not the best in the world, and some of the early quests are boring and annoying.

But some of the quests and missions/bonuses are challenging, and much more fun then trying to fight people in PvP.

Aug 02, 2005, 07:41 AM // 07:41

^^^

PvE players dont have to PvP.

PvP players have to PvE.

That should clear a bit of confusion up

Anarkii · Aug 02, 2005, 07:58 AM // 07:58

All such threads seem to turn into a PvP vs PvE war. Enough has been said on the issue already, so I wont add to it.

There was some talk about ANet vs Blizzard. Yeah, ANet is "supposedly" very community-friendly, reads the fansite forums, and implements suggestions actively. They update the game more frequently than any other developers do.

Has ArenaNet added significant content to the game since the release? No.
Have they fixed all that was broken? Hell, No.

They had a long apha and beta period. Couldnt they have BALANCED all that was there to balance THEN? All they have been doing since the release is a few minor balancing changes. The economy is in ruins. PvP fans have been complaining about NR for a long time now. PvE fans, about the lack of content.

On, the other hand, Blizzard openly admits it doesnt bother about what the community posts in the official forums. Suggestions, bugs, improvements...nothing.

But the Bottomline is, they created two massive legends Starcraft and Diablo. Those games live forever . I dont need to love the developers, I need to love the game.

And I am going back to D2 with 1.11

wheel · Aug 02, 2005, 08:01 AM // 08:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by RTSFirebat

I find it interesting that most (From what I seen) PvE people are happy to do some PvP sometimes, we don't complain, or bitch, we just get on with it. Me personally I do enjoy PvP or the Tombs every now and again.

Yet to make it to the HoH however

lol

And then again a lot of PvP are unwilling to try PvE in return, calling it "grind" and annoying. Ok the game's story is not the best in the world, and some of the early quests are boring and annoying.

But some of the quests and missions/bonuses are challenging, and much more fun then trying to fight people in PvP.

Much more fun than trying to fight people in PvP? Why are you posting in a PvP discussion when you are obviously a PvE'er? You have nothing to add to the discussion other than "quit whining." BTW, PvE players whine and complain all the time about farming nerfs, so don't act all high and mighty.

Blackace's post speaks volumes, and it just emphasizes a lot of questions:

Why do PvE players want to force PvP players to play PvE? No one is asking you to play PvP.

Why are PvE players against something like UAS in PvP only, that their PvE characters would gain access to temporarily while in a PvP arena, that is on a completely separate ladder fom whatever PvE ladder that could be made up? PvP players having all the skills does nothing to how well you can farm Underworld or Fissure of Woe, or do whatever random quest. It allows PvP players to do just that, PvP, without going through the tedious PvE BS.

Makkert · Aug 02, 2005, 08:14 AM // 08:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anarkii

They had a long apha and beta period. Couldnt they have BALANCED all that was there to balance THEN? All they have been doing since the release is a few minor balancing changes. The economy is in ruins. PvP fans have been complaining about NR for a long time now. PvE fans, about the lack of content.

The skills are generally very balanced, leaving Nature's Renewal discussion aside.
That takes tremendous balancing, and is something that isn't accomplished easily. In fact, a perfect balance of skills in betatesting....i'd say slim chances, something is bound to slip through. Economy in ruins? Hmm...it seems prices are a bit stable more then they were in the beginning...ecto's 10k, shards 3.5k, max storm bow 15k, runes & dyes pretty stable. Maybe not perfect, but certainly improved from what it was, not the hyperinflation i saw at first.
It's people's nature to bitch on the things that go wrong and forget the positive things done. As for NR...yeah, something tends to slip through in design/testing usually. Even as obvious as this one, it happens. I see it happen in games that are a LOT more mature then GW, like Magic (for you players out there: Skullclamp. enough said).

Zeru · Aug 02, 2005, 08:32 AM // 08:32

Quote:

The skills are generally very balanced, leaving Nature's Renewal discussion aside.

Right....

Not many skills are broken like renewal (pretty much fertile affecting spirits) but there are still some that fit in the absurdly good category such as ether renewal, ward v melee, etc, and many many skills that fit in the trash bin like any skill starting with 'mind', rust, etc.

I dunno, I find it's hard to ask people to look onto the bright side when in the past 4 months the game has gotten worse. If it was bad to start with, yeah, some people would have a point, but you see....it wasn't.

RTSFirebat · Aug 02, 2005, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheel

Much more fun than trying to fight people in PvP? Why are you posting in a PvP discussion when you are obviously a PvE'er? You have nothing to add to the discussion other than "quit whining." BTW, PvE players whine and complain all the time about farming nerfs, so don't act all high and mighty.

Blackace's post speaks volumes, and it just emphasizes a lot of questions:

Why do PvE players want to force PvP players to play PvE? No one is asking you to play PvP.

Why are PvE players against something like UAS in PvP only, that their PvE characters would gain access to temporarily while in a PvP arena, that is on a completely separate ladder fom whatever PvE ladder that could be made up? PvP players having all the skills does nothing to how well you can farm Underworld or Fissure of Woe, or do whatever random quest. It allows PvP players to do just that, PvP, without going through the tedious PvE BS.

See what I highlighed in bold.. your first mistake is thinking I'm only into PvE, which I'm not. You see I'm one of these RARE people who likes both PvE and PvP and doesn't mind doing them both!

I love to battle against other players, PvP. And I love to gain quests, exployer the massive map, collect skills, and make money, PvE.

Seems you read my last statement and cared not for anything else I had to say... you see a UAS button is stupid. I really don't think PvP should be given access to everything in one go at all.

what the devs should do is try to reduce the so-called PvP grind that is faction points but making the amount of points requires to unlock skills and items much lower... like making it 300 for a skill and 1000 for a elite one... since 3000 is a bit over-the-top to say the least.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheel

Why do PvE players want to force PvP players to play PvE? No one is asking you to play PvP.

Think you answered your own question, most of us don't mind a bit of PvP, since once you complete all the quests and missions ingame there nothing left to do but PvP, most of us take it all as fun.

Maybe A.net is forcing PVP only people to play the PvE game a bit, which could be address, but giving you a "I'm lazy UAS Button" is not the right way to go about it.

Maybe if you stop to think... "why don't I just give PvE a go and stop complaining so much?", you may come to enjoy it.

Now don't take that last statement as a flame, since it not meant to be, I just wish you could see things from both sides of the fence.

Phades · Aug 02, 2005, 08:51 AM // 08:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by RTSFirebat

Maybe if you stop to think... "why don't I just give PvE a go and stop complaining so much?", you may come to enjoy it.

The problem is that most of them have at least once and they do not enjoy it, otherwise they wouldnt be stating otherwise.

PieXags · Aug 02, 2005, 08:55 AM // 08:55

So...is this thread anywhere near the original idea of it? I can't tell amongst the gigantic circles of repetition that's been said in countless thread before, the OP was good. After that...kinda went to hell and doesn't make much sense...

ratatass · Aug 02, 2005, 09:03 AM // 09:03

Its funny...

Who started The Guild Hall (gw)?
Who started Guru ?
Who started Gwonline ?
Who have been the largest site contributors in these forums?
Who has advertised this game in the gaming community ?
Who has called newspapers to get journalists to take interest ?
Who has gone to the local EB games store, Best Buy and others to make sure that they get the game in their shelfes ?
Who has contacted Anet about certain regions in the world that haven't planned on putting the game on theirs shelfs ?
Who has called their best friends mothers and distant cousins to advertise the game ?
Who tested and provided the most valuable feedback to Anet during the Betas ?

It sure as hell is not the regular Joe picking up the game at Walmart at release....

The answer to the questions above are: The Top gamers, the competitive and active forum members, The Guild Leaders, The Alpha Testers. The EDGE as I would call it.

Anet could be making mistake. They are pushing away the very people that has backed this game the last two years, the very people that has helped make this game better. A cathastrophy for Anet ? No,no they will be ok. But they will leave behind a community of Competitive gamers that are very dissapointed. But who cares...

I am sure as hell not going to call the two biggest newspapers in my native country as I did before release and invite them to try the Beta game or push for an article or review...for the expansion pack....

Hell no....

With the Alpha Testers now out of the loop in the forums, with the top guilds leaving and with a horde of disgruntled "top" players also leaving, the future looks bright for the Guild Wars Community....

On another note, I always take a look at the join date of the posters in this forum before I read their posts or in any forum, and as you can see....the majority now has joined in June, July....new to the game...they are also the majority of the posters too...most of them never played in the betas...they never saw the promised land. But if they are happy, thats all that matters...isn't it ?

but what do I know...

Ratatass

Takkun · Aug 02, 2005, 09:22 AM // 09:22

have u ever thought a few of these members who have just joined used to have another name, but decided to change it by making a new account on the forums?

Or maybe they have been busy viewing other forums since the world preview event like me and only just started looking at these forums.

Don't judge a book by the date it was issued.

Oh but yea as a Beta Tester and a regular at the guildwars websites and forums since day 1, I know very well about what was expected in this game as far as the PvP goes, and what little was supposed to be expected as far as the PvE goes. Seems Anet's outlook on this game was later being viewed through a fish-eye lens causing Anet to try to force players to go through what little content they had in the PvE, Knowing very well the lack of content there actually was going to be ( As stated by Anet as I recall... about 7? months ago in one of the fansite fridays...)